Parenting Grown Children: What Dr. Spock Forgot to Tell Us

Money Matters: Helping kids work their way through debt

In a follow up to Vanguard's posting on adult children and debt, the site let's us know what readers think. Some of the more insightful observations of matters financial are these:

BUYER BEWARE: "Some of you admitted to, or alluded to, confusion over the terms of student loans and the implications of those terms. “Read the fine print” was the phrase that struck me. (I was looking at a promissory note from Sallie Mae this week, and it’s not an easy document to get through.)"

CO-SIGNER BEWARE: "Interest deferral—and the eventual addition of deferred interest to a loan’s principal—was a shock to some of you. One parent who signed for a loan for her daughter experienced credit-score damage when the daughter defaulted on the loan for a few months. So, “caution” may be a great byword for all of us."

BACK TO BASICS: "Another reader got my attention with some advice I remember learning very early in my career: “Financial prudence comes from managing limited resources. You cannot learn to prioritize if you do not give up discretionary items for essentials.”

YOU, THE TEACHER: "A number of students said some well-timed advice on managing money and debt would have been very helpful. One former student related his college experience of accumulating $17,000 in student loans as well as credit card debt—and not having a clue how to pay it off. Many of you pointed out that the responsibility for teaching our children to handle choices (money and debt included) is ours, as parents. The bottom line: Everything may be possible—just not all at the same time."

Money Matters: Are we too late to help them deal with debt?

Through my 401K at work I get to invest retirement money through Vanguard. Vanguard, in turn, tries to keep me up to date on my investment options and, occasionally, more. As in this recent piece, which I've edited to shorten but you can read the whole thing here and follow any subsequent comments.

"Students these days are graduating from college with significant debt: According to the U.S. Department of Education, the total outstanding federal student loan debt exceeds $500 billion. Worse still, many graduates have little or no experience in managing a budget, and many have had (and may continue to have) parents who bailed them out of debt crises—postponing the inevitable experience of managing their own debt. This is a serious problem.

A recent study by Sallie Mae talks about students living beyond their means, and on average running up credit card bills in excess of $3,170. That doesn’t include average college-loan indebtedness of $21,000 at graduation, and an increasing default rate for those loans just short of 7%.

Not all graduates are in the same circumstance. Plenty have worked their way through, carried loans, competed and won scholarships, and know exactly what they need to do to pay down their debt and keep financial control of their lives. Kudos to them. But suppose we haven’t done our children the favor of making them at least partially financially responsible during or after high school? Is it too late to remedy that?"

Well, that was quite a surprise coming from a financial institution. My reaction to the question she raises was one I posted as a comment on the site. It went something like this: While parents may have postponed their children's ability to budget and deal with debt, many of us can no longer afford the bailout.  Is it too late to teach adult children lessons that should have been learned when they were in their teens? The question in my mind is, if we couldn't allow them to feel the pain then, are we up to the challenge now--especially when the are stakes higher and the pain may be more prolonged. I think the financial issue masks an emotional one: The desire to ease the way for our children. We aren't necessarily doing them a favor.

what do you think?

I

Money Matters: An Aussie take on what we can afford to give our adult kids

The economic retrenchment is, as we know, global. We aren't the only families having to pull back financially, and that includes support for our grown children--be it paying off a college debt or helping with the down payment on a house. A report out of Australia mirrors what many here are experiencing.
Evidently, the hard times down under are silencing the peal of wedding bells. Here are some highlights from a report by the St George Bank:

Generation Y expects parents to help pay for weddings, house deposits and education fees, but concerns over retirement and debt have taken priority for most mums and dads.

70 per cent of baby boomers believe the global financial crisis has seen their assets shrink in value, and 71 per cent are now concerned about their financial health. As a result, only 6 per cent of parents rate providing financial assistance to their adult offspring as a top priority.

Almost half of those parents with adult children said they were focused on saving, either for retirement (25 per cent) or other future expenses (24 per cent).

Another 41 per cent favored paying off debt, either their credit card (24 per cent) or mortgage (17 per cent), the survey showed.

Bottom line: “Circumstances have changed for many and it’s understandable that parents are now having to focus on their own needs and financial health,"a general manager of the bank said. “As a result, when it comes to paying for things like weddings, first home deposits, overseas travel and childcare, many Gen Ys must now stand on their own two feet.”

Money Matters: How to talk about money

They've got tips--100 of them--for discussing money, an always touchy topic when it comes to talking to your adult kids without making them feel like you are muddling in their financial life. They are Kathryn and Captain Frugal of the Money Saving Blog.

Here are some of the tips aimed at the adult children themselves (and that we, as their parents, should bear in mind):

39. Set clear boundaries. Decide on your own what you will and won’t discuss with your parents and financially and stick to those boundaries.

40. Respect your spouse and children. As you get older, your family priorities shift away from your role as a child and towards your role as a parent and spouse. When discussing finances with your own parents, respect the rights to financial privacy that your other family members have.

41. Rely on parents for financial help only as a last resort. After you’re on your own, you need to be responsible for your own finances. If you rely on parents for help, then they are going to feel that they have a right to tell you how to spend and save and you want to avoid that.

42. Don’t overreact. You don’t live in your parents’ house anymore so you don’t need to get all worked up about their opinions on your money. Just listen and let it go.

43. Find non-money things to discuss with your parents. Parents sometimes try to get us to talk about money because it gets us riled up. In a weird way, this makes them feel that they’re still closely involved in our lives. If we are close in other ways, this will be less of an issue

44. Use the “I” word. Parents still feel responsibility for your finances since you’re their child. They’ll feel less responsible if you talk about your own feelings and situation without blaming them.

45. Stop talking about the past. The financial past is over with so deal with it and move on.

Here are some tips for you, as the parent of grown and independent kids:

72. Do more listening and less talking. Your kids needed you for advice and financial guidance when they were young. Now they need to sort things out on their own with your sound financial ear as support.

73. Let your adult kids know that you’re willing to help them learn how to budget, save money and get into investing. Then wait until they say they are ready for your help. When they ask, be there to assist.

74. Invite them to attend financial classes and workshops with you.

75. Solicit your kids’ advice on technology as it applies to money. They probably know more than you in this area!

76. Admit your changing financial fears. As your kids become adults, they are ready to hear the reality of your fears about money as you get older. Admit this and find a proactive way to eliminate those fears together.

77. Consider their finances when planning family things. You may want your kids home for Christmas but if this puts a financial burden on them then it creates a lot of stress. Discuss the issue openly to resolve the financial aspect of these things.

78. Put your financial affairs in order. This will help when dealing with money as you get into your older years.

Money Matters: What if the kids are over their heads in debt?

It's one thing to struggle with your own fiscal problems--retirement looming, nest egg shrinking. But it's even worse to watch your kids fall into debt. What do you do about that?
That's a question raised in a recent Washington Post column, which advises parents of grown children NOT to denude their own assets in an effort to save their children. Certainly, putting ourselves in a position where we are no longer self-supporting is dangerous. But sharing some of our assets with a child who runs into fiscal trouble can be the right thing to do--depending on the situation. As I see it, the help line can be drawn between a child's bad judgment and misjudgment.
Here' are highlights from the column: 

Don't jeopardize your own finances in order to help your child, particularly if you’re nearing retirement age and have a fixed number of years to build up/resuscitate your savings plan. Borrowing from your 401(k) (if there’s anything left in there) or tapping a home equity line of credit to help pay off your kid’s debt isn’t a great idea.

Don't be afraid to pass judgment on your child’s debt. You’ve weighed in on everything from the cleanliness of their rooms to their Friday night date, so why should debt be any different? You may decide to treat student loans or health-care costs as worthy causes while credit card debt from that new flat panel TV is not. The last thing you want to do is enable them to continue what could be a vicious cycle of spending.

Treat a loan to your adult children as a full-fledged loan, complete with interest. (If that makes you feel guilty, you could always return the interest to them after the final payment as a surprise.) As with any loan, write down the terms of repayment and decide what the penalties should be for late or missed payments.

Returning to the Nest: Do you still have to wash their socks?

They're moving home again. Sixty percent of young adults move back home--staying for no one knows how long.  The rules of the house that worked so well when they were youngsters don't quite apply now. So how do you work things out? Do you ask them to pay rent, lay down cleaning and cooking rules? Do you still wash their socks?

I found some pointers recently on how to manage the move-back so that everyone remains on speaking and civil-living terms. The advice sheet notes that happy “re-filled" families tend to have several things in common. Here they are in brief:

Set limits: Talk about how long the live-in arrangement will be: three weeks, three months, a year? And define mutual expectations for house rules and responsibilities.

Set Goals: Talk frankly about the reasons, financial or otherwise, behind this new living arrangement, and lay plans for the transition back to independence.

Discuss Rent: Some families start at one rate. Then, as an incentive for their child to move out, they raise the monthly rent a predetermined amount as the months tick by. Others charge rent, but set the money aside and present it as a nest egg when their child is ready to move on.

Set Chores: Whether it’s in lieu of rent or in addition, include household chores--making dinner twice a week, for example, buying groceries, doing laundry or yard work.

Discuss Guests and Booze: It's unrealistic to set curfews for a fully-grown, independent adult, but you can discuss and agree on a set of household rules, particularly on hot-button issues such as late night or overnight guests, relationships, and alcohol or other substance issues.

Make a Contract: Whatever the plan, whether it’s rent, chores or household rules, spell it out beforehand and put it in writing.

Money Matters: Having less for the Little Ones (who are now big)

I don't mean to be repetitious. It's just that the reality is all around us and everyone is feeling it: $3 trillion has seeped out and disappeared fromour 401ks and other savings or retirement accounts. For many of us, that loss wipes out money we had hoped would cover a downpayment for our kids' first house, their college or graduate school tuition, or tide-over money while they made their way through grad school or their first (low-paying) job. And, of course, our kids are scrambling to stay on their feet, knowing the safety net they had assumed was there is, well, not.

Not a good feeling. Here's a little statistical meat to back that up: 

Stat one: Nearly a decade ago, the Center on Wealth and Philanthropy estimated that the U.S. was on the verge of the largest inter-generational wealth transfer in history—$41 trillion, with about half if that dough being passed on while the benefactors were still alive.

Stat two: A recent Boston College study estimates that as many as 30 percent of older households are less secure in retirement as a result of the decline in housing values.

The disappearance of a sizable chunk of our generation’s money and security has left many of us resetting priorities--particularly when it comes to spending. Vacations are the first thing that seems to get downgraded. One friend reports: We've canceled the three-week trip to India; we're renting a beach house and inviting the grown kids to join us. We hope they'll suggest chipping in. We'll take them up on it if they do. 

What sort of trade-offs or steps are you taking to adjust to recent losses and keep what's left of your nest egg in tact? Have you changed your retirement plans? Travel plans? Spending patterns? Has it affected your ability to help your kids?

Not happy thoughts. But sharing ideas can help.

Money Matters: Helping the kids till it hurts

For many of us, gone are the days when we could open our wallets with ease and help our grown children when they were in need--paying off a college loan, helping with the down payment on a house or even defraying everyday living expenses. Now our 401ks are half of what they were, the value of our homes has shrunk. Our personal sense of wealth is melting away. And yet the kids still have needs--needs we want to fill. Not just to ease their way but because right now it may be tougher for them at the beginning of their careers than it is for us at the tail end of ours.

It appears to be the same rough go for the Brits. A recent study by Scottish Widows (must find the origins of that name!) found that adult children were sapping their parents and grandparents of large amounts of money, forcing them to cut back on daily spending and to take on more debt.

The research showed that one in six of those parents who have given money to their children have increased their own levels of debt, while one in ten have had to put a stop to any kind of savings of their own in order to fund their children. Moreover, nearly a quarter of adult children or grandchildren are using or have used parental handouts to fund their day-to-day living expenses or spending money. Over a third needed the money to pay off debt, and 30 per cent needed the cash for a house purchase.

Here's one other point from the research: Of the 6,000 adults surveyed, almost half of those that have already given money to their children expect to dig deeper and give them more in future.

Money Matters: When the kids face foreclosure

To lend or not to lend when your grown children face losing their home. Not an easy call--especially if your own fiscal well being is greatly diminished. Here's some general advice on the subject from a Washington Post columnist Michelle Singletary. Singletary is answering a question posed by a sister about saving her brother's house when the brother is an undisciplined spender:

"If you ask someone to use a cash gift in a certain way, such as for college tuition or catching up on a mortgage, the recipient should honor your request to the best of their ability. However, once you extend a gift, the money or item is no longer yours to control. You have to leave it to the person's conscience to do the right thing.

"Before giving someone thousands of dollars to save a home, you should ask to see a written budget and the underlying documentation, such as pay stubs, bills, etc. Yes, this is an intrusive demand. Yes, the person or couple might balk, refuse or even cuss you out.

"But if people are asking for a significant amount of money, they need to prove to you that your money won't be wasted. They need to prove their financial situation has improved. Or they need to demonstrate they are becoming better money managers. Otherwise if you bail them out, and a few months later they are behind again on their mortgage and the lender forecloses anyway, you've done what your mama told you never to do -- throw good money after bad.

"If you're not equipped to help someone establish a budget, then require that the person see a qualified credit counselor. Send the person or couple to DebtAdvice.org or call 1-800-388-2227. DebtAdvice.org is a service provided by the members of the National Foundation for Credit Counseling."

"Even if a friend or family member's foreclosure is looming, don't let that person's desperation result in your giving money that in the end will just postpone the inevitable. Help if you can, but in a way that means your generosity won't be in vain. "

Money Matters: Helping the kids with their expenses

Sally is feeling good about how she's handling the helping hand she gives her adult son: She's offered to pay for day care. Her son is in the middle of the struggle years--finished with graduate school but just starting his career; ditto for his wife. Right how, with a one-year-old, costs are suddenly high [day care; bigger apartment] and income not quite what it will be.

Day care is not an inconsiderable expense in the city where her son lives--close to $18,000 a year. Fortunately, Sally can afford it. She's still working and so is her husband and the father of her children. Nonetheless, it's a bite out of their budget, and Sally is proud that she's paying the tab "with no strings attached." That's what she likes about the arrangement: She pays the bill and she doesn't have to concern herself with whether they are doing with the "loan" what you want them to do with it. It's control without actual control.

Or so she thought. One Saturday her daughter-in-law came by with the baby so Sally could babysit while the daughter-in-law ran some errands. No problem. Sally enjoys taking care of the baby. It's her first and he's delightful. When her daughter-in-law got back to the house, she pulled out her shopping bag to show Sally what she'd gotten. A beautiful outfit to wear to a friend's upcoming engagement party. Sally got a glimpse of the price tag and flipped out. It was, she told me later, twice as much as she would ever spend on an outfit. In her mind, here she was shelling out $18,000 a year for day care to help her son's family get through the "struggle" years and here was her daughter-in-law splurging on a high-priced blouse and skirt. Sally resented it.

So the question is whether we can ever cut the string--the tie between gift and spending? Do we have the right to control the money we help our kids with? Andif we do, will they resent it? Will we feel uncomfortable? I come from a family where my widowed mother was generous but there were strong and bounding ties to what I did with her generosity. So personally, I am all for giving the gift and letting it go. Don't look back. Just assume you've helped and move on. But is that reasonable? Should there be guidelines--a blueprint for use; a performance measure of sorts--when we help out our children?